Obama supports building a mosque at ground zero

DreamnetRob said:

Use logic ???? You are the one with the flawed logic.

Let me see if I got this straight according to your logic. You believe ...
* Al Queda are terrorists
* Al Queda are muslims
* Therefore all muslims are terrorists.

Using your login you could apply a huge generality like that to anything.
* Catholic priests are petophiles
* Catholic priests are Christians
* Therefore all christians are petophiles

Need I go on with this absurdity you are spouting?

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Petophiles? What is a petophile? And many Christians would argue that Catholics are not Christians. As would Catholics.

I get your argument and I agree. I've said a similar thing here. But you giving ample room for somebody to disregard your argument.

DreamnetRob said:

The one part I agree totally on is the Muslims "moderates" need to be more brave and speak out.



.

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Because they'd be beheaded? :dunno: Ask the author of The Satanic Verses, Salman Rushdie, how peaceful those radicals are.

LaLiLuLeLohan said:

Petophiles? What is a petophile? And many Christians would argue that Catholics are not Christians. As would Catholics.

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WTF. Catholics are not Christians. Since when has the term Christians belong exclusively to the many branches of Protestantism. Has it become a code word to exclude Catholics. No Catholic with half a brain would say they are not Christians. If anything they would say Protestants are heretics and not really Christians. I don't give a fuck about any religion but the use of code words to exclude any group drives me crazy.

:yinyang:

YMIHERE said:

WTF. Catholics are not Christians. Since when has the term Christians belong exclusively to the many branches of Protestantism. Has it become a code word to exclude Catholics.

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Umm, about 5 hundred years ago.

Christianity is a term that contains those Messianic faiths that include the Gospels outside of Catholic Dogmatic context. Catholicism is a single faith that depends on the Papacy to interpret said Gospels and claims made by popes, Saints and martyrs since the death of Christ and the death of Paul/Saul of Tarsus.

Catholicism, as an example, permits prayer to not only God and his son/incarnation, Christ, but to those who have become saints. Catholicism is a polytheistic faith. Post-Luther faiths are not.

YMIHERE said:

WTF. Catholics are not Christians. Since when has the term Christians belong exclusively to the many branches of Protestantism. Has it become a code word to exclude Catholics. No Catholic with half a brain would say they are not Christians. If anything they would say Protestants are heretics and not really Christians. I don't give a fuck about any religion but the use of code words to exclude any group drives me crazy.

:yinyang:

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There are definitely differences between Evangelical Protestantism and Catholisism. Mainly in some minor ways. Protestantism broke off because catholisim was based on things like the catholic church allowing people to buy off their sins and because of things like praying to Mary when she is dead.

Bloodshot Scott said:

There are definitely differences between Evangelical Protestantism and Catholisism. Mainly in some minor ways. Protestantism broke off because catholisim was based on things like the catholic church allowing people to buy off their sins and because of things like praying to Mary when she is dead.

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A minor discrepancy. As was the entirely nepotistic clergy cycle and infallible popes who fathered pups.

*presses SARCASM button*

LaLiLuLeLohan said:

A minor discrepancy. As was the entirely nepotist clergy cycle and infallible popes who fathered pups.

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They could alleviate a lot of their problems by simply letting their priests get married. The reason they don't do that is so the priests can devote their time to their parishioners. You simply don't hear of pedophilia in the Protestant sects.

LaLiLuLeLohan said:

Umm, about 5 hundred years ago.

Christianity is a term that contains those Messianic faiths that include the Gospels outside of Catholic Dogmatic context. Catholicism is a single faith that depends on the Papacy to interpret said Gospels and claims made by popes, Saints and martyrs since the death of Christ and the death of Paul/Saul of Tarsus.

Catholicism, as an example, permits prayer to not only God and his son/incarnation, Christ, but to those who have become saints. Catholicism is a polytheistic faith. Post-Luther faiths are not.

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I don't want to start a theological argument here but you don't understand Catholics at all. All I am trying to say is the any religion that believes Christ was God is a Christian religion.

YMIHERE said:

I don't want to start a theological argument here but you don't understand Catholics at all. All I am trying to say is the any religion that believes Christ was God is a Christian religion.

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That's an awesomely convenient argument, but the problem is twice fold: I was raised a Catholic and I can comprehend modern English.

I understand Catholicism, thank you. It cost my folks about 15K to do so, but I understand it. Please explain how The Vatican's generational interpretation is the same as Luther's overall accepted argument.

Bloodshot Scott said:

They could alleviate a lot of their problems by simply letting their priests get married. The reason they don't do that is so the priests can devote their time to their parishioners. You simply don't hear of pedophilia in the Protestant sects.

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I assume the Vatican will radically retract this policy. Considering the reason that they are so pro-amnesty is that their clergy and membership are becoming non-existent .

in five years, the Vatican Catholic Church will accept anybody willing to join. Within seven years, The Catholic church will be a bastion for gays. MARK MY WORDS.

LaLiLuLeLohan said:

That's an awesomely convenient argument, but the problem is twice fold: I was raised a Catholic and I can comprehend modern English.

I understand Catholicism, thank you. It cost my folks about 15K to do so, but I understand it. Please explain how The Vatican's generational interpretation is the same as Luther's overall accepted argument.

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I don't give a fuck about the papacy and infallibility and if only the text of the Bible is the true source of knowledge or if faith alone is sufficient for salvation. I think they are all crazy. We are getting way off topic here and if you want to discuss this further start a thread about it.

LaLiLuLeLohan said:

I assume the Vatican will radically retract this policy. Considering the reason that they are so pro-amnesty is that their clergy and membership are becoming non-existent .

in five years, the Vatican Catholic Church will accept anybody willing to join. Within seven years, The Catholic church will be a bastion for gays. MARK MY WORDS.

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This could be the case. Episcapalians already have gay priests; the gays have tried to infiltrate the Lutheran church with moderate success. Sadly the Catholic church is in many ways all about the $$$ so of course they want Latino/Hispanic illegals to infiltrate our border as well.

Bloodshot Scott said:

There are definitely differences between Evangelical Protestantism and Catholisism. Mainly in some minor ways. Protestantism broke off because catholisim was based on things like the catholic church allowing people to buy off their sins and because of things like praying to Mary when she is dead.

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Protestantism began in England when Henry VIII seperated the Church Of England (Protestant) from the Roman Catholic Church in 1534, it is believed a major factor was him wanting to divorce his wives, which he did several times.

DreamnetRob said:

Trident1 .. you talk in such circles and flawed logic I can't make sense of what you are trying say.

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it boils down to this:


not a republican voter=terrorist supporter jew hating anti-american

emceeemcee said:

it boils down to this:


not a republican voter=terrorist supporter jew hating anti-american

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I'm a Centrist not a Republican.




"terrorist supporter jew hating anti-american"?

Well if the left actually did something constructive with their time instead of bashing the US, Christianity, etc etc and put aside their limpdick brown nosing of Ahmadinnerjacket, Islamists, Communism, Che shit, etc etc etc then all would be well.

Ulysses31 said:

Protestantism began in England when Henry VIII seperated the Church Of England (Protestant) from the Roman Catholic Church in 1534, it is believed a major factor was him wanting to divorce his wives, which he did several times.

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Wasn't Martin Luther the most influential figure in the Protestant reformation?

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&...rfai=Cy9bUApBvTIqwLI-GNKK5ye0PAAAAqgQFT9Anwb4

Anyway, I'm definitely fascinated with religion. I'd like to get a Masters in something to do with religion maybe some day. It's very interesting subject matter. :2 cents: I'd even like to maybe study something on Odinism, the religion of some of my ancestors, well before Christianity and Catholicism.

Trident1 said:

The religions supposed "moderates" are mute to condemn their zealots

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DreamnetRob said:

The one part I agree totally on is the Muslims "moderates" need to be more brave and speak out.

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Bloodshot Scott said:

Because they'd be beheaded? :dunno: Ask the author of The Satanic Verses, Salman Rushdie, how peaceful those radicals are.

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I already posted these once on this thread, guess I'll post them again.
Interesting how those with strongly preconceived notions appeared to just skip right on past them.

The internet is loaded with sources referencing moderate muslims and muslim groups speaking out against terrorism.
You could spend all day on the first link alone.

http://www.muhajabah.com/otherscondemn.php
http://www.religioustolerance.org/reac_ter16.htm
http://www.alislam.org/response.html
http://www.ciogc.org/Go.aspx?link=7655053

muslims and muslim groups condemn Fort Hood violence:
http://www.google.com/#hl=en&q=musl...=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=&fp=eb25b226ce9fcffe

Trident1 said:

I'm only speaking about muslims and their religion not christians or catholics or whatever your yammering about.

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He's yammering about a hypothetical analogy. Condemning the lot for the sins of a few is dumb.

Trident1 said:

Islam is in dire straits. It's been politicized, militarized by it's own high level clergy for decades since the late 60s to combat Communism. It had religious schools churning out mindless robots who hate Jews and the West because they're told so. The religions supposed "moderates" are mute to condemn their zealots and take action against them. So what's left to do but assume everyone deep down harbors some anti West anti Semitic notion, pro Islamist ideology.

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If 'everyone' felt this way deep down there are a whole lot of things that couldn't be possible.

There is an overwhelming majority of Muslims that are absolutely pro west and pro American. Where the reticence stems from is America's coddling of any and everything Jews do...Certainly if there are jews sitting around believing 'everyone' harbors some deep down pro Islamist ideology and they are acting on it...they are doing their part to help create the mindless robots who hate jews.

The point is, people are individuals. I personally don't "support" building the thing or not. It is a way overblown issue and the first reporter who reported this as a mosque on ground zero should be relieved of his/her press credentials.

So when is the first community center raffle or chilli cookoff?

How could you guys of the anti religious far left political persuasion possibly advocate for a known far right wing persuasion of religious faith, a faith whose members have guaranteed that everybody must convert or die? Have the christians ever made such threats? You wouldn't defend them under any circumstances. I just don't understand where the connection is, is this where the extreme far left meets in harmony with extreme far right?
I plead with you, disclose your hidden agenda for all to see! Stop beating 'round the bush, be consistent! The muslim community sure as hell ain't gonna tolerate your risque progressivism, that's for damned sure, so why come to their defense?


Why would you be citing the Constitution of the United States of America as a means of defending your muslim fiends . . . err . . that's friends. Is it because the predominant number of people killed on 11 Sept., 2001 ended up being capitalist oriented people? No problem, you despise capitalists, the muslims despise capitalists.:dunno:
-or- Is it because the potus say's that it's OK to build a mosque in such close proximity to the site where approx 3k capitalists needlessly perished at the hands of radical extremist muslims, you must therefore march lock step with your freshman senator commander in chief? Other? :dunno: